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Post by vajramukti on May 20, 2008 19:33:35 GMT -5
Vaj at some point during that endless life, you would'nt get bored or tired of it all. Would you not want to move on to the great unknown. Or are there conditions to that immortality? michael I think physical immortality would be painful in that one would outlive all one's children and loves. Maybe. But, I am not wishing to be the ONLY immortal. In my fantasy, in the end, there can be EVERY ONE. |
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Post by Frater G on May 20, 2008 22:38:49 GMT -5
I think physical immortality would be painful in that one would outlive all one's children and loves. Maybe. But, I am not wishing to be the ONLY immortal. In my fantasy, in the end, there can be EVERY ONE. That would be the best scenario. Here's a thought.... If one knew one were physically immortal might that fact alone slow down or maybe prolong the time line toward enlightenment? Perhaps in some cases it would never happen. I mean mortality is quite the motivator wouldn't you say? |
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Post by michael on May 21, 2008 10:56:00 GMT -5
VYesterday at 6:33pm, vajramukti wrote:
Yesterday at 7:16am, G wrote:
I think physical immortality would be painful in that one would outlive all one's children and loves.
Maybe. But, I am not wishing to be the ONLY immortal. In my fantasy, in the end, there can be EVERY ONE.
GThat would be the best scenario. Here's a thought.... If one knew one were physically immortal might that fact alone slow down or maybe prolong the time line toward enlightenment? Perhaps in some cases it would never happen. I mean mortality is quite the motivator wouldn't you say? I find that just when we start to become ourselves, enlightened we die. Maybe that enlightenment could be achieved in one immortal lifetime.
If we knew we were immortal, I guess we would lose all that fear that we all carry. michael  Housework would be endless! |
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Post by elijah on May 21, 2008 11:19:57 GMT -5
I think if we knew we were physically IMMORTAL, human nature being what it is, would become further complacent and even more spiritually inert.
To most people, the thought of the end, death, the Great Unknown, God of the Big Stick and Waving Finger, whatever, ultimately makes one face facts.
Michael said : "Maybe that enlightenment could be achieved in one immortal lifetime." is this what you meant or is there possibly a typo?
I suppose that physical immortality would eventually result in enlightenment as that is eternity, but I would prefer enlightenment in one mortal life, then shed this vehicle and become nothing with the Universe again forever as an Immortal.
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Post by Frater G on May 21, 2008 19:37:19 GMT -5
I think if we knew we were physically IMMORTAL, human nature being what it is, would become further complacent and even more spiritually inert. To most people, the thought of the end, death, the Great Unknown, God of the Big Stick and Waving Finger, whatever, ultimately makes one face facts. Michael said : "Maybe that enlightenment could be achieved in one immortal lifetime." is this what you meant or is there possibly a typo? I suppose that physical immortality would eventually result in enlightenment as that is eternity, but I would prefer enlightenment in one mortal life, then shed this vehicle and become nothing with the Universe again forever as an Immortal. I was thinking.. you know time seems to go quickly when one is having joyful experiences such as vacation with loved ones at a fantastic place. All along however one knows that the vacation will end and so will the pleasure... so we think. Perhaps one never fully realizes the moment. Looking at the opposite scenario time stands still when one prefers to be elsewhere. Sometimes it feels like a prison sentence....self made. The moment is analyzed continuously. Immortality, the extension of life, which means more experiences...more moments you could say. So being that experience is what is important.. analyzing the moment as much as possible. Therefore to extend the experience is to extend life. |
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Post by elijah on May 22, 2008 12:27:28 GMT -5
Therefore to extend the experience is to extend life. The paradox is: what is life, and why is there the incessant need to create and maintain this mortal existence, if it is inexplicable, and most human entities do not seem to know how to define life, let alone live it?  |
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Post by George the 3rd on May 22, 2008 12:53:32 GMT -5
Therefore to extend the experience is to extend life. The paradox is: what is life, and why is there the incessant need to create and maintain this mortal existence, if it is inexplicable, and most human entities do not seem to know how to define life, let alone live it? IF one assumes that all that exists is the product of a Creator, then it must also be assumed that the incessant need to create and maintain mortal existence, in whatever form, must be a part of the Divine Plan. |
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Post by George the 3rd on May 22, 2008 13:35:19 GMT -5
Ojibwe Prayer to a Slain Deer
I had need,
I have dispossessed you of beauty, grace, and life.
I have sundered your spirit from its worldly fame.
No more will you run in freedom
Because of my need.
I had need.
You have in life served your kind in goodness.
By your life, I will serve my brothers.
Without you I hunger and grow weak.
Without you I am helpless, nothing.
I had need.
Give me your flesh for strength.
Give me your casement for protection.
Give me your bones for my labors,
And I shall not want.
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Post by vajramukti on May 23, 2008 10:23:07 GMT -5
That would be the best scenario. Here's a thought.... If one knew one were physically immortal might that fact alone slow down or maybe prolong the time line toward enlightenment? Perhaps in some cases it would never happen. I mean mortality is quite the motivator wouldn't you say? I feel the opposite. Life is short, and I have many things to do. If I were immortal, and knew it, then time would not be a factor, so I could be free to set aside 100 years or so to seek enlightenment. Currently, I have to "steal" time from other endeavors, and some of those, such as my job and parenting, are not just things that I can set aside. There are so many places that seem to touch me spiritually that I would like to go. But I know that a day or two or even a week will just not suffice. Imagine knowing that I could drop everything and go live in a monastery in Tibet for 20 years, or near the Mayan ruins. |
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Post by morningstar on May 24, 2008 16:25:52 GMT -5
I can certainly understand Vaj's sentiments here...but if I were to ask my self if I would like to live forever in my present state...the answer would inevitably be, No. This present state I am in has and is serving me well...I have learned - I have grown - and I hope to continue to do so in this lifetime. But, in my present understanding, to wish to live forever in our present states defeats the meaning and the purpose of the grand scheme. The illusion we exist within is one encased within our physical mortality...the shell we inhabit in order to "experience" - for it is through experience that we gain true understanding and defined perception. I believe that the "experience" of physical mortality is somehow a very important lesson in our sojourns here. I think that consciousness in itself is eternal...yet, somehow, our consciousness must experience the physical in order for ascension to manifest. Life here cannot be eternal - it is not meant to be so...it is but a stepping stone in the whole of things... Perhaps it is a way to come to appreciate that which we are...that which we have always been...and that which we so seek to reach out to... It is a lesson in understanding given behind a veil of mortality... We all have entered into the cycle of birth, life, death...and it is in this cycle that we must come to appreciate that which we have always known... is death itself an illusion of sorts??? During one of our family gatherings around the campfire awhile ago...there was a cactus on the table. I don't know the name of this cactus...but it blooms every so often, I think every other year - it sends out the most beautiful white flower, much like a lily. The flower itself only lasts for a day or so...then it dies. Some of the younger people there were admiring this flower - and when I told them that it would probably not be there in the morning they gathered around it to have a good look and paid special attention to it ... and their sentiments were the same - "how sad, it's so beautiful but it lasts such a short time"... and I found them really "looking" at that flower - really "seeing" it...because it wasn't going to be there tomorrow. And so, that beautiful flower became the focal point of the evening...and everyone seemed to pay it homage. That flower provided a great lesson to all who witnessed it...so then do our own lives provide the same lesson.  |
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Post by Frater G on May 24, 2008 19:06:12 GMT -5
That would be the best scenario. Here's a thought.... If one knew one were physically immortal might that fact alone slow down or maybe prolong the time line toward enlightenment? Perhaps in some cases it would never happen. I mean mortality is quite the motivator wouldn't you say? I feel the opposite. Life is short, and I have many things to do. If I were immortal, and knew it, then time would not be a factor, so I could be free to set aside 100 years or so to seek enlightenment. Currently, I have to "steal" time from other endeavors, and some of those, such as my job and parenting, are not just things that I can set aside. There are so many places that seem to touch me spiritually that I would like to go. But I know that a day or two or even a week will just not suffice. Imagine knowing that I could drop everything and go live in a monastery in Tibet for 20 years, or near the Mayan ruins. You know visiting all the places you have in mind could be done after the children are on their own. Retirement can be a good thing because at that time of our lives hopefully we will be mature and wise enough to really take in the experiences while traveling. Twenty years in a Tibetan Monastery sounds good though. I hear you brother. Morningstar! beautifully said...your words are wise indeed. I like your analogy. |
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